Dog Pro Radio – EP 2: Tom Davis

[00:00:00] Yo, turn it up. Let’s go. Welcome to Dog Pro Radio.

Welcome to Dog Pro Radio. 

Matt Covey: Welcome to Dog Pro Radio. Fabian, Jason, how are you guys today?

Fabian Romo: so far, so good. You know, everything has been going great. We’re running a workshop here with Cameron Ford. Uh, so, uh, we’re doing the canine cognition this week and then, uh, sound detection, um, later on in the week. So, that’s been kind of taking up all the time, which is great, honestly. So, busy, busy. How about you, Jason? 

Jason: We’ve got trainer school full swing. They’re almost halfway through. back in January and we’ve got handler school up in the last week here this week. So got a good group there. got a dog in it that we donated. Free, free police dog. Believe it or not, [00:01:00] I can sell police dogs cheaper than I can give them away.

It’s easier than I can give them away. This one’s going to Tijuana, 

Mexico, believe it or not. Malinois, that was owner surrender, problematic, had a bite history. Long story short we were able to get through that, resolve it, and now he’s gonna go be a police dog in Tijuana.

Matt Covey: Well, that is awesome. You guys both have more interesting weeks than me. So this is the highlight of my week. I’m excited about this episode today. For all the listeners, just so you know the setup of the show, the three of us are the hosts, but each week or each episode we’re going to have a separate moderator because we need someone to introduce the guest, someone to make sure we don’t Go on a three hour tangent about some obscure dog topic and someone to wrap up the show So we don’t keep our guest for too long.

So today that’ll be me and I am honored Our guest is amazing and he’s someone I share a passion with so Really cool. And to be honest, our guest doesn’t even 

it introduced, but I’m going to do it anyways. So our guest today is Mr. Tom Davis. Tom owns [00:02:00] Upstate Canine Academy. He owns the No Bad Dogs brand.

He is obviously one of the most famous dog trainers in the world. He’s obviously a great dog trainer, but he’s also figured out a way to YouTube and social media to build his brand. Tom makes it look easy. He makes it look so easy because he does

Fabian Romo: Did 

Matt Covey: He’s got his own dog tree collar.

Fabian Romo: I get it all right? 

Matt Covey: kennel with his stuff all

Fabian Romo: I’ll be right back. 

Matt Covey: color scheme it’s he’s got it all. So. 

welcome to the show. We are super excited to have you here.

Tom: That was incredible, Matt. I can, I should keep you around. That was great.

Matt Covey: I’m like, I’m your hype guy.

Tom: I, I guess that was awesome. Thank you. Yeah. Thank

Matt Covey: Yeah, absolutely

Tom: I always love you know, talking dogs and seeing what’s going on. So I appreciate it.

Matt Covey: for sure. And before we get into who you are and what you’re all about I do want to

thank you on the behalf of the IACP You know, we work really hard to, there’s very few people out there trying to protect our industry, right? Trying to protect what we do for work, how we [00:03:00] train dogs, tools, dog sports.

I mean, there’s people trying to ban everything out there and kind of destroying this whole way of life. And when someone

Fabian Romo: Everybody here heard the great Jose Instituto de Calixto Prueba. told. we’re gonna show you some sample material again 

Tom: Yeah, likewise. Right back 

Fabian Romo: Uh, 

Matt Covey: yeah, absolutely. 

Well, why don’t we get Why don’t you tell everyone? Who is Tom Davis? What are you all about?

Tom: Yeah, I, know, I’m really just a dog guy, you know, I, I I got into working with dogs professionally because I, I didn’t really want to go the traditional route. I couldn’t go to the traditional route considering the circumstances of my life at the time. And so I was like 19 or 20 years old and really it was just like, what can I do?

What do I want to do? Like, what could I wake up every day and love to do? And that was dogs.

Fabian Romo: [00:04:00] Well, 

Tom: so that’s really like the beginning of my career and it still is my career. Nothing has really changed. It’s just the, the format in which I,

Fabian Romo: Scam 

Tom: is different. And so I would just say I’m very passionate about sharing knowledge to people who want to learn. And also just understanding that I’m a human

Fabian Romo: negativity 

Tom: and things change and things evolve. And feel like I’m just, you know, I’m very grateful for the opportunity to have the platform

Fabian Romo: there. so you come into a, there’s 

Tom: With

Fabian Romo: usually like 70 Shervin people or something that really Shout outs and subs not for art. You could 

Tom: you know, I’m a dog

Fabian Romo: attract people for Komfood Found out they were coming to Camp I really understand why people Inavable’s job description is in there, but 

Tom: up, I try to learn more about dogs than I did the day before.

Fabian Romo: download it as a file. We’ve got [00:05:00] a, 

Tom: consults sitting right here prior to having 

Fabian Romo: link to the solid source code, the link is in the chat, 

Tom: to not only

Fabian Romo: at the top of the slides. It’s just a little bit of a video. I’ll show you. 

Tom: but take the

Fabian Romo: So let’s I’ve, I’ve learned 

Tom: and then it down and distill it down

Fabian Romo: a while 

Tom: package for dog owners who just want to help their dog.

So.

I think in a nutshell,

Fabian Romo: So it’s a very traditional thing we do and we will show how it works. So let’s get, let’s get started. 

Tom: creating things like, I think that that’s kind of what Matt, you were saying

Fabian Romo: Thank you. 

Tom: I guess, you know, found a little niche into creating content and creating a platform on every single social media platform. And I love doing that, because, like you said before, I think that we live in a world that can be very polarizing, it can be filled with radical hate, hateful people, and I’m really proud of the platform and the community that I’ve built, because it’s really simple with me, I, if you don’t [00:06:00] agree with me, that’s okay, we can still be friends, or you can move on. And I’m really passionate about creating things and, and showing people different ways of doing things because ultimately I want to help as many dogs as I can. So, that’s me.

Matt Covey: Fabian.

Fabian Romo: I was going to ask a question. I think, getting to know Tom a little more. the last episodes, we, we were talking to pretty much all the board members, everybody here on the, on the podcast. We asked, like, what are the most impactful experiences that motivate the work that you do? Right? What is like your reason for doing what you’re doing?

Obviously, was there a scenario or a situation that made more of an impact for you that was like, You know what? This is going to be the thing that sparks what I do, right? Like, and commit myself to the industry and do the dog thing. you know I don’t know if it was a dog or a case, but I think that’s, you know, it’d be great to know what motivates you. 

Tom: Yeah, was a couple things. It was like a, 

a recipe of things. And what, what really committed me to this industry is just understanding that if I didn’t, I didn’t do what I’m doing, [00:07:00] 

then I would like dogs would, you know, there’s, there’s so many great professionals out there, but if I didn’t do what I was doing, it would be 

selfish.

So that’s how I feel. I feel like I, there’s a mixture of, you know, experience, right? Like training for over a decade, working with as many people as I can, getting my hands on thousands of dogs. But then there’s also like. As a, I consider myself an artist because working with dogs is artistry, right? You have to, you have to go with the flow.

You have to switch gears. You have to be able to read the room. You have to be able to see what your partner is going to do next in order to be successful. And for me, it was really just like this natural gift also that I, that I feel like a lot of people who work with dogs have like, wow, how’d you do that with that dog?

I’m like, I didn’t, what did I didn’t, I didn’t do any, you know what he’s talking about. So for me, it was like, it took me years to realize that I was doing things with dogs. That other dog owners couldn’t necessarily [00:08:00] do, right? They were looking at it like this, you know, great thing and I was like, this is just like life, you know?

And I think a lot of people who work with dogs have like, like musicians, right? Or, or any other type of person that’s in art. They can just pick up a guitar and just start the thing, right? Or drums or putting ink to a canvas. Like, how did you learn that? Like, I didn’t learn that. I just have that. And for me, that’s what it was. That was like the pinnacle for me is I have a passion for dogs and I’m so grateful for the gift that I was also given and then, you know, I, I dedicated, like there’s, there’s obviously ton of

Fabian Romo: Transcription 

Tom: well. so that’s what the turning point was it for

Fabian Romo: by CastingWords 

Tom: dog.

It was just realizing, Oh crap, why would you pay me for this? That took me, you know, It, that’s, I feel really

Fabian Romo: Right. 

Tom: easily. So then that’s where it was. I was like, this would be, it would be so selfish for me to just turn the other way on [00:09:00] thing that I have. And I also really love people.

I love helping people. I get, I get the most joy in life is. Giving somebody a ride when it’s raining. Pulling somebody out of a ditch. We live in upstate New York. That happens all like that’s the happiest, the highest I’ll ever be is like doing those for other people. And so

that with dogs. It really just, it was a perfect match. It was like, I can help people with their dogs.

Fabian Romo: I’m a I’m 

Tom: you know, that’s why in the beginning of my career, I called myself an educator because I really wasn’t training dogs and I’m still not. But,

Fabian Romo: a I’m a I’m a I’m a I’m 

Tom: it’s a weird thing to tell people 

trainer when, you know, technically I am, you know what I

Fabian Romo: Yeah, yeah. I don’t think, honestly, I don’t think that’s weird at all. I feel like it’s something that comes up a lot because, you know, people handle and own the dogs. So really dog training is most of the time, it’s just, you know, people coaching all the time. But, but I think that’s where the, the dog industry is like a people industry.

It’s something that I’ve always felt because they’re the ones taking care of the dogs. [00:10:00] They’re the ones that are You know, honestly, paying the bills, making sure the dogs taken care of, like, you know, doing, doing the thing. So, helping people is such a it’s a I have that common ground,

Matt Covey: well, why don’t we jump into the meat of the conversation here. And so, Tom, I already had told you 

this. We polled the audience and said, What do you guys want to hear Tom 

Davis talk about? And 

everyone was like, He’s the reactivity guy. Let’s talk about reactivity. So We’re excited to chat leash reactivity with you or any type of reactivity with you today. And, you know, a few minutes ago, you had mentioned something about never stopping 

learning. And what I see is for a young trainer, it’s can be hard to grow, right. And hard to learn and hard to get these skills. So if for the, like all the young trainers listening today or just newer trainers, I guess they don’t have to be young. What is some advice you would give them specifically for leash reactivity? If you were, you know, geared towards trainers, not just dog owners. 

Tom: Yeah, I think my honest opinion is it’s not really, it’s not, you’re going to, if

training that

to [00:11:00] leash reactivity or aggression, it’s not for everybody. I think that trainers automatically initially think that if they don’t do something that they’re, that maybe they’re not comfortable with, then that means that they’re a bad

farther from the truth.

So I think if people are interested in getting into reactivity, just understand. That you might get to a point where you’re like, you know what, really, is, not comfortable with this because then it becomes dangerous. You’re doing something

Matt Covey: Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Tom: of dog training. And, but if [00:12:00] you are interested in getting into working with reactive dogs, I also. Have objectively look at the landscape internationally, not just in the states and the majority of people who are taking on the real leash reactive dogs the, in the aggressive dogs are

ability to

in that space, right?

Like there’s people who maybe get into the MMA octagon that like thrive off it. And then there’s other people that would want to crawl in a hole, right? So it’s the same thing, right? I, so I think. If you’re, if you want to get into it, then the best thing to

Fabian Romo: and like, the, 

Tom: is 

other 

who are doing it. 

That’s the 

to

Fabian Romo: the, the 

Tom: to be

Fabian Romo: core content of the document is 

Tom: You know, if I read cookbooks my whole life, but I’ve never

dish.

I can’t sell anything.

Fabian Romo: is the, 

Tom: that would be the two things that I would 

is oftentimes people who

because [00:13:00] they’re called to it, or maybe

they can’t turn business down, but I would just say no training is better than bad training.

Don’t get yourself into a situation where you’re uncomfortable because that’s where you’re going to get hurt. The dog ultimately could also get hurt, you know, if they hurt you because you weren’t comfortable or versed in that. And so my biggest advice is just understand there are limitations to people because it’s not for everybody.

I would like, I get really excited when there’s a dog that wants to rip my throat out. Other people typically shy away from that. And like I said before, like even my own trainers would be like, they,

Matt Covey: Okay. Hmm.

Tom: you’ll, you know, if you get hurt,

Fabian Romo: I think you’re 

Tom: you could end your

Fabian Romo: going to want to stay on this thread. 

Tom: good

Fabian Romo: So [00:14:00] I think you’re 

Tom: a big

Fabian Romo: going to want to stay on this thread. And, 

Tom: to do with it and know how to handle it’s like riding a bull. if I jumped on a bull right now, I would fail and probably get my neck broke.

And I would be like, wow, I suck. It’s like, no, you don’t suck. You don’t know what you’re doing. takes years of experience to really get comfortable with how to work with these dogs and how to move with them and read

Fabian Romo: making sure that you’re always on the right side of the wheel. Thank you. Thank 

Tom: is presenting and then dish it out to the owner that’s going to be sustainable, which is a whole different beast. So that would be my two senses. Just work with somebody who’s already doing it. So you’re safe. 

you an opportunity to integrate into, Hey, here’s a good dog for you to start with. Don’t just. You don’t feel like you have to offer that training if you’re not 

it

Fabian Romo: Yup. 

Matt Covey: I think that’s great advice for sure. 

you know, I don’t know

Fabian Romo: Thank [00:15:00] you. 

Matt Covey: it’s 

such a big bucket of dogs, right, where

Fabian Romo: Yeah. 

Matt Covey: very different if you

Fabian Romo: I love that. 

Matt Covey: that was attacked at the dog

Fabian Romo: You know what I’m, 

Matt Covey: a dog, he, you know, barks and

Fabian Romo: So, 

Matt Covey: very

German Shepherd that really enjoys targeting on his

Fabian Romo: So, 

Matt Covey: time. And I think a lot of new trainers or dog owners don’t know how to make those distinctions. advice for people on figuring out just more about their dog to figure out what path do they need to go down? Because obviously you modify the training based upon the dog.

Tom: Yeah, that’s a great question. For me, it really comes down to kind of like how you already segwayed into it is dogs who are re so to define reactivity for me, because that helps set the stage, is a dog that’s going to react to anything that enters their environment. It doesn’t mean that they’re mean.

It doesn’t mean that they’re aggressive. It can, but not every time

really excited when they see their, their [00:16:00] favorite person or their favorite Amazon person that gives them cookies or their favorite dog that they go on play dates for. They’re reactive. They’re pulling on the leash, they’re barking, they’re spinning, they’re whining.

They’re doing all the things. And so, so that’s the definition of reactivity for me first, because that’s really important because dog training, especially the dog training community, that’s where things kind of I think get muddy is we’re not defining what we’re talking about because my definition can be completely different than somebody else’s.

And then. not on the same page already. So that’s my definition. And then I typically will put things, I will typically put dogs into categories and it’s typically three different categories. First category

Fabian Romo: I’m going to be sharing with you a little bit of the process of getting that information out to you. So, if you have any questions, feel free to reach out to me. 

Tom: because they’re excited

Fabian Romo: I’ll be happy to answer any questions you may have. Thank you. 

Tom: what what we see for fear dogs. 

one would be 

overstimulation.

Fabian Romo: you. 

Tom: be fear and insecurity of not really knowing what to do. [00:17:00] Vulnerability. And 

the third would be a dog

Fabian Romo: Thank 

Tom: other people, doesn’t like other dogs.

And that’s a smaller one too. So the bigger leash reactivity cases that we typically work on is a dog just Not knowing what to do. They’ve gotten bad advice from their, their owners their whole life. They’re vulnerable. They’re insecure. They’re basically bluffing to say,

Fabian Romo: you. you. 

Tom: typically.

Fabian Romo: Thank you. 

Tom: that’s

Fabian Romo: Thank you.

Tom: Then if you were to ask me. makes a dog reactive versus aggression versus aggressive, it would be like their intentions. I posted a video on that on social media. It got like 4 million views in 24 hours, which is, which created a lot of a lot of things, right? And a lot of people were saying like this is reactivity and this is aggression and I’m like, yes

Fabian Romo: and just to, to kind of hint at what’s going on, are just They have three kids. They work two jobs and they have a dog because they like dogs. They [00:18:00] don’t want to

Tom: You know, sequence of dog behavior and understand the terminology that dogs will use about negative reinforcement and all the, they just want to know is their dog actually trying to kill

Fabian Romo: as as, far as the panel here. 

Tom: the line of the intentions behind the dog. In my experience, dogs who are actually really wanting to hurt another dog or another person are more quiet than anything. They’re usually targeting, locking, getting to them. Dogs who are typically more vocal on the leash are more frustrated and they don’t really do anything when they get to such thing. And so I think that that’s my opening lick on defining the different things.

Matt Covey: great description and quiet is scary. If they’re quiet and they’re confident, that is so much worse than the loud bluffing dog. Fabian, you were starting to say something though?

Fabian Romo: I was going to ask about specific process. Obviously working with so many reactive [00:19:00] dogs, with someone like you, Tom, do you have a certain process of a certain certain types of reactivity or something that you’re like, Hey, this type of dog is having this XYZ problem, say dog aggression.

This is how we’re going to assess it. Like, is there some go to processes that you’ve discovered over time that are like, Hey, this is how we’re going to assess it. This situation calls for this process to make sure that everyone’s safe and making sure that, we’re able to to work with the dog properly. 

Tom: Yeah, and to give context to again, I think it’s important to give context the way that I 

train in my process of training is likely going to be different than most people because my 

circumstances of training are typically different as well. I usually the most time I have with the 

dog is 48 hours typically. So there’s that 

right? Like if I had more time than my approach, maybe slightly different. So my point is, is 

be safe. I don’t necessarily suggest this to everybody. It’s just when I, when I train my training style right now is basically done in seminars surrounded by a hundred people with their phones out with a dog with a [00:20:00] bite history with an owner.

That’s a puddle, you know? So my training style has adapted and you know, I could argue with myself about it’s gotten Better because of that, right? All that pressure, like you have to, you know, to make sure that you, that you do well for this owner. And so I think that that’s important to just understand, but my process is typically, like a mechanic or a doctor would is I want to hear the symptoms of why you’re stressed. Because as a dog trainer, what I’ve realized over the years is if we can start reducing the stress of the dog owner, of how low hanging that fruit is. Things will get better drastically quicker because the dog owner, which is the person that’s the cause and the solution of the leash reactivity is becoming more confident, is becoming more comfortable, is now becoming more capable and empowered help their dog where before they show up and they’re like, Oh, just help me.

They just dump it on me, you know, and so my process is typically to immediately start empowering the [00:21:00] owner and. Pulling off the low hanging fruit that we can do and that that also goes two ways of literally doing that of like hey Put your arm down Stop looking at your dog or it’s You have these symptoms.

We’re pulling we’re lunging. We’re reacting We’re air snapping. We’re reactive. right, so you want to stop? So this is typically my format my formula and if I were to write a book it would be on this and it would Be about three pages This will pretty 

like this, it’s like this, this cycle that that happens is I 

you into

solution rather or not.

You want to do that solution because it takes a lot of work is different, but it’ll, it’ll probably help you tremendously if not fix the issue. So my formula is, is very commonly looked at like this. Somebody comes in with a reactive dog, they’re doing all these things. So the dog owner is coming in because of the stress. Of the pulling

in the barking. That’s why they’re coming in. That’s why they want to pay you,

Fabian Romo: A little bit 

Tom: [00:22:00] your car into the mechanic because they have a flat

Fabian Romo: less. Good. Okay. Let’s take a look here. 

Tom: the flat tire and and it does I call it the stop syndrome And I tell people like you can’t just stop Something from happening.

That’s not the way dogs work. That’s not the way animals work. So, so I start off by saying, you want to, you want to stop these symptoms. So you have to play into it a little bit. You have to be fun with it. You want to stop these problems. Okay. So your dog is lunging. Let, let’s just go and let’s just see what you do a little bit.

Let me just see. You can just walk your dog from here to here. And they usually can’t. They get dragged. The dog pulls them. I say, all right, that’s fine. Just put your dog into a sit for me. Sit. Sit, sit, sit, sit, and they start reaching for treats. I’m like, okay. I said, here’s the thing. what I’m looking at here.

And this is, this is like the most helpful thing for, because I used to just take the leash and go, look what I can do. I don’t do that anymore. A, because I have nothing to prove. B, I realized that it’s not super helpful for the owner to see what a professional dog trainer can do with a dog. But in the beginning, I certainly [00:23:00] did because I had so much to prove and I wanted to prove and now I don’t.

And so now I say your dog, you’re, you want to stop your dog from doing these very primal things that are likely caused from the lack of your communication skill sets and your, and your foundation. But I’m like, so do you see, I go, so you want to stop this thing way up here, I said. But unfortunately. You can’t ask your dog to sit or even walk nicely for four feet. You see the problem? Oh, yeah, that makes sense. then I start kind of like picking apart, you know, hey, don’t don’t sit Because of these reasons put your arm down because of these reasons stop looking at your dog because of these reasons And I just 

it as, you know, digest as digestible as possible for the dog owner.

Cause I usually give analogies and I’ll give them, this is why I don’t want you to do

Fabian Romo: To Hello I You Speak English Today [00:24:00] Is B Two Thank you for watching.

Tom: Behaviorally, there’s a significant chance that you don’t have the skillsets that you want them to do alternatively. Period. Somebody comes over to the house. My dog lunges and barks at the front door. How’s your place? What’s that? How’s your stay? What’s that? How’s your down? Well, okay. We, you know, we can’t, we, we can’t move forward. So these are, that’s typically my format. And then I start, here’s, here’s the magic sauce for me. Once, you know, I do these in seminars, which is, which is really, really fun to see. And it’s exciting to see. Dog owners will come into a with these symptoms, reactivity, bite history, the whole nine. I start picking out these little things that the dog owner is doing to either confuse the dog to frustrate the dog to make the dog feel more insecure because the owner is not handling confidently and well, you know, I always say like who’s driving the ship here, what’s going on?

Like if you’re not going to take the wheel, I will. And that’s what your dog [00:25:00] is doing. we start nitpicking these little tiny things like, you know, get rid of the 12 foot leash that you’ve wrapped around your hand and it’s around your neck at the same time, get rid of the, you You know, the harness that’s encouraging the dog to pull when you have 150 pound Rottweiler that you’re complaining about pulling. Once I start taking these low hanging fruit pieces off and I start developing the handler, I kid you not typically by the end of the seminar, the dog that came in with reactivity that we didn’t even address, like we never really proof the reactivity, how to correct it, how to minimize it, how to read it, how to time it by the end of this seminar, the end of my three day program at my facility, which is the only

Fabian Romo: Transcripts 

Tom: The dog doesn’t react and

Fabian Romo: are available in English, 

Tom: the 80 percent of my

Fabian Romo: Spanish, German, and Spanish. If you have any questions, please feel free to contact me. Thank you. 

Tom: like, Holy crap. And I’m like, guys, it’s the cause and the solution. It’s this loop that dog owners get into. So my formula is typically that I do get the one off. [00:26:00] Actually aggressive dog, which takes much more time 

energy and 

And it typically takes me, like I’ve gotten into seminars now where I tell people my opening monologue, if you will, that I don’t, my goal is, is to handle your dog for less than five minutes, this whole seminar, because this isn’t the Tom Davis gig. This is, I want to, this is the experience I want you guys to have.

And so that’s typically. I’ve tried to train dogs sustainably through the owners without taking the leash too much nowadays, because I find that that’s the most sustainable aha moment. Dog owners will have because it’s not dogs by Tom. It’s people by Tom. I’m not in the dog business I’m in the people business. Nobody gives a crap if you know, you’re like, hey, I’m gonna give you money Can you make my dog look good? I’m like, I’m a professional dog trainer That’s that should be everybody should be able to do that, right? So that’s that would be my format Fabian to answer

Fabian Romo: No, that’s great. Thanks for answering that. I think that [00:27:00] obviously giving your brand, the no bad dogs and dealing with a lot of really reactive dogs, you probably attract a lot of people. A group of people that are like, I have a dog that’s really challenging. Let me bring it to Tom. So is there like some stats that you have in terms of, not necessarily stats, it’d be mental things like how many dogs are actually aggressive, you know?

And what do you see are some of the most common solution, what the most common, symptoms that. are easily addressable. Like how many, like what patterns do you see in terms of the crowd that comes to you? 

Tom: the easiest two patterns that I see Every single dog owner that comes to me almost every single one is they’ve never told their dog 

No, I want to stop something but i’ve never told him I wanted 

him to stop. Okay 

Fabian Romo: That’s huge. 

Tom: Yeah And then, and then it’s just, it’s just the stop it syndrome. It’s they haven’t taught the skills. Hey Tom, my dog’s pulling me on the 

leash. I’m Like okay. You know, they have four legs. We have two. We’re basically asking them to walk in slow motion. How’s your, you know, how’s your heel? How long have [00:28:00] you worked on your heel? Well, don’t, I haven’t. I just want to stop the pulling. Okay. Okay. You know, it’s like, it’s like calling up a personal trainer and be like, I want to look like Arnold Schwarzenegger in 

his prime. You know, like I, I just want that. It’s like, okay, well it’s going to take two years. It’s going to take a lot of time in the gym. It’s going to take your, a nutritionist, right? It’s like, I don’t, I don’t want to do that work. It’s like, well, that’s what you need. So those are the two things is they’ve never their dog when their dog did something they don’t want them to do easy. you know, big thing, like for an example, for the listeners, there’s like jumping so many times dog owners struggle with like. The dog jumps up and the owner’s like, what do I see? What do I do? They’re scratching me and they’re at get off. Right. And I’m like, no, we’re off. Right. And then within five minutes, the dog just doesn’t jump.

And I’m like,

Fabian Romo: Right. 

Tom: And then, yeah, it’s the skill sets. I don’t want my dog to freak out when people come over. Well, you have a dog, so that’s not realistic, but what you can do is you can tell your dog to go to their bed or go to their place and stay [00:29:00] there. Well, I could never do that.

I’m like, exactly. That’s why your dog is freaking out when people come over, and that’s why you can’t have people over. So, those are the two things. What was the

Fabian Romo: How many dogs do you feel like are actually aggressive? 

Tom: yeah. It’s like one out of 50 for me. 

like you said, I primarily deal with reactivity, you know, resource guarding, reactivity, bite history, dogs, court cases. so, so that, so, so just understanding my demographic, I see a lot of react, reactive dogs. And I would say like one out of 50 is actually 

not they, and to be, to be clear. me. 

I’ve been in the industry long enough to understand that there are some bad dogs Because of their genetic disposition because they were abused because they have a screw loose because they have some sort of mental neurotic you know that goes off and they’re mean and they’re nasty and behavioral euthanasia is the fairest thing for for that

Fabian Romo: Right. 

Tom: rare. know, I I find myself the people who were You know, so, [00:30:00] so I tell people all the time, you know, people ask me again, a lot of my, my students come in, like, how do you, you know, how you grow your business? I’m like, you just stop worrying about what other. People think about you because so many times people are like, really, like no bad dogs.

Obviously you haven’t worked with enough dogs. I’m like, you guys don’t, you don’t understand the big

Fabian Romo: Yeah. Okay. 

Tom: No bad dogs is a symbolic way to, to, to grasp an audience. Like Fabian, you already said it. It’s like so many people are like, I got a dog for you. And, and the general idea, the reason why I trademarked and came up with no bad dogs as a brand is because I got so sick of saying, it’s not your dog’s fault.

My dog pulls me. I need to get rid of him. I need to. You know, I’ve, I’ve, I’ve had people try to euthanize dogs for pulling on the leash. So yeah, I made a

Fabian Romo: So that’s it. 

Tom: my 

and on my stickers and on my water bottle. No bad dogs. Cause there’s a good chance there’s a 99 percent 

That if your 

is misbehaving, it’s your fault. There’s a 0. 

percent chance that you actually have a dog that wants to[00:31:00] 

But those dogs are extremely rare. In, in, in, you know, in the whole scheme of things.

Matt Covey: To

Fabian Romo: That’s all I have to say. 

Matt Covey: with you.

Fabian Romo: going to get out of here. Bye. 

Matt Covey: but where I see a lot of people lacking is their ability to read a dog and

doing what it does. you just spoke a lot about mechanics of what you do at

Fabian Romo: I’m going to do a little 

Matt Covey: the

Fabian Romo: bit of a recap of, 

Matt Covey: How they

Fabian Romo: what we’ve been doing in terms of,

Matt Covey: you spend teaching them what to look for? Like, you know, we use the words targeting and loading. I know

But what are

on to make sure they know what their dog’s about to do and why they’re about

Tom: That’s a great question.

Fabian Romo: Um, 

Tom: do

Fabian Romo: Um, 

Tom: that. Um, I typically don’t get, get to that point until later on in the training. But a lot of times. It’s I’m, I’m

Fabian Romo: that will take place from November 25th through March 19th. 

Tom: of reactive. So I teach them

Fabian Romo: Thank you. 

Tom: their dog. I teach them how to do an inside turn. I teach them how to do an outside turn.

I teach them how to put their dog into a sit. I [00:32:00] teach them how to lure their dog. I teach them how to correct their dog if they are reactive. So a lot of times I do teach that in, in the process of training, but I teach the, here’s what we’re going to do when. If and when your dog reacts, then I,

Fabian Romo: Hello. It’s a pleasure to be here. 

Tom: into the mixture, I’ll say, okay, heel 

then I see the dog building and I’ll do an insight turn. And a lot of times what I’ll

Fabian Romo: I’m 

Tom: the first time they do it and I’ll show them

Fabian Romo: so excited to be here. And I’m excited to be part of this 

Tom: up the mouth shut.

Fabian Romo: great event. 

Tom: doesn’t

Fabian Romo: So, I’m a grantee. And this is a grantee -grantee event. 

Tom: literally will

Fabian Romo: And so, 

Tom: here’s what you’re looking for.

So the

Fabian Romo: I’m 

Tom: to help

Fabian Romo: here. to, I’m here to talk about what we’re doing At the University of Michigan. 

Tom: show, take a video and show them when their dog is going to 

done that before on video. I’m like, this dog is about to

two, it’s magic. And it’s like, no, it’s not magic. It’s just, it’s like dog trainers should be able to [00:33:00] read that

Fabian Romo: Yeah, behavior. 

Tom: yeah. So to answer your question, I do, I do, I do cover it, but a really easy way to cover it simply is just film them then show them

Matt Covey: I love that idea. 

Absolutely love

Fabian Romo: So during the entire conversation, obviously you’ve, you’ve talked about process and a thing that keeps coming up is correction, right? And so I think that across the board, all trainers, specifically those that are, I don’t want to say truly helping dogs, but really putting in the time there’s the unavoidable, we have to correct the dogs, right? What is the, what is your process of correction? How do you describe it to people, specifically dog owners that have to say no to dogs, right? That’s one thing, you said. It’s like, I don’t, you know, most people haven’t said no to a dog And effectively. so how do you describe that to people? Because I feel like that’s such an effective, it has to be an effective process for all trainers, you know, to have that, and be able to communicate that. 

Tom: Yeah, it’s a great 

question. [00:34:00] Well, I have an advantage 

typically because people are like, I. Not all the people. I mean, I mean, you can see some of the people on the internet. They’re 

like, I don’t agree with this. And here’s my thoughts on it. It’s like, okay, that’s fine. But typically my clients are obviously they trust me.

They trust the process. And so, and they paid me to like help 

them. I have two 

in my entire 12 year career now, professionally that have ever against correcting the dog for what they came in for two out of all those years. So, so I, apparently. You know, it’s, I’m, I’m doing a decent job at it and, and it’s tough to say exactly.

I just tell people, I think just explaining it in a way that makes sense. Like if you were to say to people, Hey, the definition here, let’s break down the definition of positive reinforcement and you tell me, you know, what you want to do next. Positive reinforcement is to add something to the equation to encourage the behavior and likeliness for something to happen. Yeah, that makes sense. When your kid does good on the test, you [00:35:00] reward them, get them ice cream, give them a sticker. Whatever. Do it. Do that again. You’re rewarded for that behavior. A dog puts their butt on the ground after you say, sit, same thing. And then when we do, and then peep dog owners like, okay, yeah, yeah, that makes sense.

Okay. And then it’s like, okay, positive punishment because people get duped by what I call marketing manipulation. We just say positive reinforcement training and, or they’ll say positive only training. I’m like, you got to stay away from them because they’re correcting dogs and not, and not rewarding them.

It’s a little, little joke. I like to play on people because they don’t understand like the four quadrants. But, and then I just explained like positive Okay. Punishment. Positive punishment is on the exact end of the spectrum where we are discouraging behaviors and we don’t want to see them again. Okay.

Yeah, that makes sense. I say, okay, so, here’s a couple of tools that were made specifically to, to punish your dog and to correct your dog and to hold your dog accountable. For these things that you came in here for. So typically my process is very straightforward. And a lot of people, they may be a little skeptical, especially in the beginning of my [00:36:00] career.

I don’t work with anybody now. Actually, I lied. I do free dog training in parks where people don’t know me at all.

Fabian Romo: Yeah, we saw that series. It’s on social media, right? Yeah. 

Tom: Yeah, So that’s like the only time that people have been like, I actually worked with this girl in New York City and she had a dog that would chase like, I forget what it was, but would chase something at her house and I was like, Oh, have you worked on leave it?

And she’s like, yeah, it doesn’t work. And the dog was on a harness. So as I’m digging in my bag for like. The least amount of scariness for the owner, like a plastic pinch or a slip leash or something. She’s telling me, I don’t 

believe in those prong collars. I don’t think that they’re, they’re right. And I get this plastic pinch collar out, which is just a, it’s a smaller, it’s a plastic prong collar.

That’s better for dogs who have

Fabian Romo: I was trained from here. 

Tom: hair, single

Fabian Romo: And, 

Tom: so I put that on and I did this demonstration and she was blown away. She couldn’t believe it. As she’s telling me she doesn’t like corrections, I ended up, [00:37:00] she had enough trust in me, God bless her to, to, she’s like, all right, yeah, sure. And then she was like blown away. Right there on the spot, you know, and so that’s the other thing is I just show people right? Like that’s the cool

Fabian Romo: I got really excited and excited About my first day of school. 

Tom: especially with my content. I try to leave. And if you’re in my online academy, I leave everything in. There’s nothing cut out. So. It’s also just one of those things. Like I, I put the proof in the pudding type thing where I’m showing

Fabian Romo: In 

Tom: And to be

Fabian Romo: the September last year I had my first class on a summer 

Tom: they’re like, 

am at, 

wits end here and I really need help. And so

Fabian Romo: it was like a summer break. like, I was able to attend a class For, kind of two and a half days. Right after class,

Tom: when

Fabian Romo: class, Thank you for watching. 

Tom: Because it’s stressful to

Matt Covey: going

Fabian Romo: more information visit www .ISGlobal .org 

Matt Covey: little 

bit about the, [00:38:00] the, the, the, the, the, the, 

the, 

Tom: differently.

I don’t want them to react. I don’t want them to feel like they need to bite. I don’t want, but there’s this reality that there are certain, like even dogs pulling. I have 150 pound mastiff and my wife is 110 pounds. Do I tell her walk the dog on a harness and God forbid you see a squirrel that he fancies chasing, even though his heel is good?

I mean, do we, so, so those are the, so that’s, I don’t know. I hope that answers your question, but I really just show people like on paper. What positive reinforcement

Fabian Romo: Right. 

Tom: then I give them analogies and then I show them this collar here. And some people, if they grin and they go, Oh, I don’t, I love when people are like, I don’t like this tool because I’m, I’ve never once. Had some in person. The internet is a [00:39:00] different, there’s four people who probably commented on 

YouTube today that hated what I did. Right. But in person, real life experiences, I’ve never had one person after I’ve explained what these tools are used for disagree. once people cringe about,

Fabian Romo: Right. 

Tom: callers.

I don’t like them. And I go, well, wait a minute. Let’s talk about that because I, I gravitate towards that conversation because they’re already there. You know, it’s not a random person. They’re there. They trust me. They’ve paid me. We can actually have dialect. We can talk, right? So anyway, the other thing is I, I want to know why they’re uncomfortable with correcting their dog for doing something they don’t want them to do because. It, it never like their, the logic never lines up in their favor of, yeah, I really need my dog to stop pulling or barking or not coming back when called. And I say, well.

Fabian Romo: Yeah, 

Tom: You know, you, you, you’ve also never told him no. So let’s start there, you know?[00:40:00] 

Matt Covey: earlier, Tom, about the speeding ticket, there are very few people that will follow the rules if there’s not some sort of consequence. Obviously, we all know that. And dogs are the same way. There has to Some sort of consequence, whatever it happens to be. And, you know, to your point about tools, when someone sees them and sees them used and sees them used properly, it demystifies them, right?

They’re not quite as scary when they’re like, Oh, wow, you put it on. And my dog is still happy and he’s responding really well. And he’s not, you know, terrified of you when they see it used, but there’s so many scare tactics out there that, you know, are spread around constantly that we have to sometimes overcome as trainers. So something I would love to hear you weigh in

Fabian Romo: So, 

Matt Covey: you know,

focusing on reactivity here. One of the biggest challenges I see as a trainer dealing with reactivity is When, if you’re there and you’ve got five dogs and you’re practicing your dog, their dog, and you’re working all of this [00:41:00] stuff, everything can go well. One thing I see clients struggle with is working at home when they don’t have access to a dog to work with, right? When they’re at your seminar, they’ve got all these other dogs 

I’m at their house, I bring dogs with me. What is advice you give to people if they tell you, well, Tom, I don’t have a dog to practice these passes with or to work with. What are some tips you give them? To try to make progress once they get home. 

Tom: . Good question. If, if it depends, if they’re really out somewhere where they, you know, if they’re out in the middle of Iowa and they’re like, you know, I have two neighbors, right? Then. You probably aren’t worried about your dog reacting to dogs, right? So, so if you’re talking about in the context of like a demo dog, that’s neutral and to learn around, I think that I tell people like this, you know, that’s kind of the hard pill to swallow sometimes is like, this is reality.

Like, it’s like, I have a lot of

Fabian Romo: I 

Tom: because I’m, I’m four hours north of New, well, three and a half hours north of New York city. So we have a lot [00:42:00] of

Fabian Romo: mean, I don’t know how many years that’s been going on. 

Tom: So unfortunately you’re going, your

Fabian Romo: I can’t remember the name of it, but it’s a couple of people. 

Tom: and then go outside.

Like you don’t have the leisure that we

Fabian Romo: I’m 

Tom: have fields and big yards and

Fabian Romo: It’s 

Tom: and things like

Fabian Romo: a kind of a magic wand. So you can use it. It’s 

Tom: And try to find some space where you can work around other dogs comfortably and safely. And you have to, you just have to be creative. That would be my answer.

You can get demo

Fabian Romo: magic wand. 

Tom: fake dogs. Excuse me, but,

Fabian Romo: you 

Tom: that’s

Matt Covey: Okay.

Tom: down? You know, again, it’s also like, know, having 

that you said that is a dog. Sometimes that’s what you need. That’s why we hire 

is I just had a conversation with somebody before I got on with you guys is like, you need to [00:43:00] hire a dog

Fabian Romo: going to be talking about the content of the Twitter account. 

Tom: be in a place. 

on desensitization

Fabian Romo: is a okay? 

Tom: So I said, it. If you have a, your trainer can bring their dog, put their dog in a place in a stay, and your dog can just work back and forth in that area. So your dog can catch their breath and understand and think and digest information for the first time. And so you have to get really creative as a dog trainer to, to present those opportunities for your clients.

Matt Covey: Getting creative is great advice. I always tell people, you’ve gotta be comfortable just Dog people stick together. You’ve gotta be comfortable asking a stranger. Tell them what you’re doing and asking if you can do some passes and pretty often people are pretty they’re pretty cool And they want to help you

Tom: Yeah. And the only problem with that is sometimes is that their dog is, is equally or more reactive. And then it takes, you know,

Fabian Romo: F F F F F F 

Matt Covey: for sure, all right,

Fabian Romo: F F 

Matt Covey: so I’m curious what you

Fabian Romo: [00:44:00] F F F F 

Matt Covey: a lot of reactive dogs, they are, they’re targeting with their eyes constantly, right? And a lot of them are herding breeds, and as they walk, they’re staring at everything. So, I’m not a nose work expert by any stretch of the imagination, but I’ll get a lot of my clients teaching their dog

Fabian Romo: F 

Matt Covey: With the 

idea being if you can have some fun games on the walk to engage the dog’s nose, there’s less of their brain available. to be aggressive on that walk. Jason, I know, I mean, you do a ton of

a thousand times more about that than I do. What are your thoughts on that? And I’m curious to hear yours as well, Tom, how scent work, nose work could potentially help a reactive

else to do on that walk.

Jason: Well, we, my experience is

number one. So we implement a lot of different things to include nose work and other

where we’re dealing with dogs who respond to a lot of different triggers in their environment. Mental stimulation, I think, is incredibly important in dealing with some of [00:45:00] these cases and has to be on some level, part of that plan in order to have the overall success that you want. so, you know, again,

active. We, we, we see police dogs who come into the program who may not be great with other dogs. But once we are able to a situation where they’re zoned in on working, they start to forget about

of these other

can see that same thing sort of on some level,

Fabian Romo: And 

Jason: too. 

Tom: Yeah, yeah, I

Fabian Romo: the. 

Matt Covey: Okay. Okay. Okay. 

Okay. Okay.

Okay. 

Tom: up on [00:46:00] the ball, put the ball under your armpit, start working on a focused heel, and then

Matt Covey: Silence. Silence.

Silence. 

Tom: so excited, and then the dog walks by, and they’re like, screw the dog, give me that thing, bang, and it comes out. So that’s like a really easy thing that, that people could do, or you could do it with

Matt Covey: Okay. Okay. Yeah. So, if you have a question, please feel free to reach out to me. I’m happy to answer any questions that you may have. I’m not going to take a second to answer your questions. I’m going to give you a couple of minutes to get started. And I’m going to give you a little

I’m going to turn off 

Tom: the

Matt Covey: I’m going to

of a heads up.

Tom: that

realistic for dog owners? [00:47:00] No, they’re not going to do that. So what I try to do is I say down the dog downs and, and.

Fabian Romo: Thank you for watching. Great job, all of you 

Tom: am fishing for food in your treat pouch

Matt Covey: It’s the

Tom: to happen.

And the 

So I’m using their natural drives.

Fabian Romo: I’m gonna call you by your first name. My name is, Kari. I’m. 

Tom: I also just did a talk for the special, the U. S. special forces. So Navy

Matt Covey: I’m going to go ahead and get the,

Fabian Romo: right. 

Tom: but I don’t think they’re, they may not be bridging these things together as, as, as they should. So, so that’s just something that people can obtainably go out and do is just start to

Matt Covey: [00:48:00] You

Tom: didn’t try to protect me.

If another dog said, screw you. 

You know, so I don’t, I don’t care but what I do is I counter with a down, I just say down, boom, he goes into a down. He’s

Fabian Romo: Thank you for watching. 

Tom: the dog passes. And as long as the dog doesn’t get close, we’re good.

eyes, I try to explain to people and I make it relatable.

Look, I got a dog that instinctually and with the genetics is going to be reactive and protective. He’s intact. Protective

Matt Covey: Okay.

Fabian Romo: Thank you. Thank 

Tom: And it doesn’t have to be [00:49:00] a down. It could

Matt Covey: very much.

Tom: with the tail end of a tug and the dog’s getting jacked up about that, holding it up and the dog’s focused on it. And you tell them to, you know, go here and go there.

And then you play with them after. There’s nothing wrong with that. I find that some people are like, no, we need to delete the reactivity. I’m like, guess what? This is a, you know, intact working line Malinois that doesn’t like other dogs. So 

You’re

Fabian Romo: then, and then, and then,

Tom: do something else alternatively. And you know,

Fabian Romo: you know, 

Matt Covey: the dog what it should

Fabian Romo: and then the, 

Matt Covey: saying, teach my dog not to do 

Y.

spoken a lot today. Most of what you’ve said is not about

Fabian Romo: There’s people in the audience. I think, 

Matt Covey: how to act 

[00:50:00] Right? And I think a

Fabian Romo: This is a way to 

Matt Covey: it. 

Fabian Romo: begin, Yeah.

Tom: I love, I’m gonna steal that. Matt, I wrote that

Matt Covey: you’re welcome to it.

Tom: what they can do. You can, you can play

sit.

What’s it? It’s the same. Listen, it’s the same thing I do with my kid. I was just outside playing hockey with him and he takes his hockey stick and he hits a goal and I say, yeah, great. And then he takes his hockey stick and hits me in the shin and I’m

We don’t do that. It’s literally like the most common sense 

information you could possibly think of. I think a lot of people just struggle with, okay, all that makes sense. You know, we’re not radically freaking out over this. It’s it’s how do I use the tools properly then? Cause I don’t want to mess it up.

And that’s where, you know, dog trainers should come

Fabian Romo: Yeah, if I could add something to, to the whole, you know, sound detection and it’s to me, we do a lot of protection training and a lot of sport work. [00:51:00] And one of the things that I realized is that some of the people that are really good teaching that stuff, their dogs are reactive, right? And it’s almost like through the activity of say, teaching set work in the walk or playing, the owners learn a skill of how to get, they get excited about teaching their dog something.

So they learn how to teach something reliably. So when it gets to like teaching or working around other complex behaviors, reactivity, typically the, we just describe, okay, so if you’re not going to let your, your dog bite the tug when you don’t want them to, because it’s going to ruin your game and your activity, just think about the process of training them and getting them past reactivity of other dogs, right?

Because it is an area of interest that you are now just controlling for the animal. So it’s almost as if the owners change their beliefs about what their dogs can do. And when they change their beliefs, typically dog training is much better.

Matt Covey: I’ve definitely seen a lot of reactive dogs that 

are competitive in agility. Where the owners build so much excitement and drive on that 

leash but have never learned how to [00:52:00] turn it off and all the dog knows 

is speed. That’s the one thing they know. 

Tom: Yeah. And some people, that’s all they care about. You know, I, I know a lot of, and that’s the thing I give dog owners perspective. A lot of times I’m like, I know somebody who their dogs never even stepped foot inside of a house, you know, because they’re working dogs. Like they don’t even know what a, Couches, you know, and

Fabian Romo: When you actually have the final product, you 

Tom: on?

You know i’m like You know

Fabian Romo: get kind of these 

Tom: because there are people who do build up that drive for a sport for a reason because that’s their Life, you know, that’s Like a greyhound or

Fabian Romo: the, these 

Tom: or they don’t you know, like what else what else are they gonna do?

Matt Covey: Mm hmm. Well, you know, I guess if we want to maybe pivot to the

Fabian Romo: the the, 

Matt Covey: you mentioned that about some

Fabian Romo: these the, 

Matt Covey: in the house. You know, we 

deal with these situations,

Fabian Romo: color of the, the, 

Matt Covey: they’re having issues introducing it to the

Fabian Romo: the the, the, the color of the, the the small print. And so, so, so, 

Matt Covey: [00:53:00] in the

Fabian Romo: and so, and so, and so, so, so, so, 

Matt Covey: aggression, any kind of just opening 

who’s bringing a new dog into the house, how to manage that properly, how to hopefully, you know, where are you, where do you see aggression the most in the house between two or three dogs?

And what do you do to combat that?

Tom: Well, sometimes it’s inevitable So again,

Fabian Romo: And, 

Tom: with people. I think that that’s why

Fabian Romo: and 

Tom: some of the things I say is because I’m realistic. Right? Like I,

Fabian Romo: that’s what we trying to do. 

Tom: a chance that you bring in a new dog in the house. They don’t get along. So there’s that, you know, if you want to do it successfully, typically like to your question, where I see the most aggression are people who. Are just not educated and they

well, I brought in the

into the dog’s bowl. He was eating and he attacked the puppy. And I’m like, okay, well, we don’t want to do that. Well, okay. You know, so explain it. So, so my. Kind of infusion is typically just telling people, Hey, if you have the wiggle butt king or [00:54:00] queen of, of the, the, the, the state, and they’ve never even thought about doing anything, you probably have

I dealt with it, you know, when I brought my horrible puppy home my Dutch shepherd was, you know, like, like my, my two year old real human now is, I don’t want to share things.

This is my, I don’t know you, this is my stuff to my, to my

Matt Covey: Silence.

Tom: because you don’t know what, what’s going to be a resource potentially is the

want to take it slow. If you can take it as slow as you can. And there’s so many different ways to do that. I’ve even encouraged clients to if you’re unsure of how it’s going to go, take your time, don’t let them go face to face in real life [00:55:00] for another week. Like create and rotate them until they start to acclimate with each other. And, and once they start to show interest in one another, then, then you’ll be okay, but just be safe. If you have to do, if you have to do create and rotate, if you have to do gates, if you have to do muzzles, if you have to do, you know, going for walks. I mean, there’s a lot of ways to do it, right. But I typically will see guarding. I would say is the number one reason. Excuse me, why dogs don’t fare too well because they, they don’t, they don’t treat the animal like an animal.

They just, the bones are everywhere, the toys are everywhere, the dogs up around the couch and on the bed and just no structure. And then they fight 

things.

Matt Covey: hmm. I love. Oh,

Tom: you gave them both bones and you weren’t watching them. And when one was, one was done with another one, he went up and tried to take it and [00:56:00] they fought. So I always tell people, the sky is blue, isn’t it? Like you asked for that. know, I know. So I think that that’s important is just be smart, be smart, you know?

And if you have a dog that, sorry, I 

to say, if you have a dog that, no, if you have a dog that traditionally doesn’t get along with other dogs, maybe you don’t need another dog because now it’s. You got, you know, I don’t know. There’s 

know.

Matt Covey: I really like how you said to take your time because for some reason I feel like a lot of people expect they get a new dog and it’s everything’s going to be perfect on day one. And what you mentioned about crate and rotate or using pens or baby gates or fences or something to ease into it can make all the difference. And I’m always surprised how. How resistant some people are to that idea, their thought is like, they should just, everyone should get along on day one, but they don’t realize they’re mixing animals that have never met before. And taking time makes a world of difference.

Jason: One of the

I [00:57:00] ask people a lot of times is we get students particularly, how many of you like every human you’ve ever met? And I don’t, it’s very

Fabian Romo: Me, me, I do. 

Jason: yeah, yeah. So, you know, how, how can we realistically have an expectation that our dogs are going to like and get along with every single dog that they meet?

I just think it’s pretty unrealistic.

Tom: Agreed. I, yeah, I tell people all the time, I’m like, you have a better chance of your dog not liking another dog than you do them liking a dog. 

Matt Covey: completely. And it’s amazing how taking time with it can make a big difference. And to your point, Jason, it’s not just about liking a person, but first impressions and everything happening quickly could be hard. Imagine, If you are at home and a strange man walks into the house, probably not going to handle that very well, right? Because you have no idea they’re coming, you don’t expect it, and that’s what people put their dogs through. All of a sudden they [00:58:00] show up with another dog they just rescued, and they’re surprised their adult dog is like, What the hell just happened? Why is this dog in the house? And, you know, they don’t take the time to do proper introductions. Well, Tom, I know you have a lot going on today, and we’ve, we’ve gotten through Quite a bit. We very, very much appreciate you taking the time to do this. I know you squeeze this in between other things you have going on today, and we definitely appreciate it.

Tom: Oh, thank you. I appreciate it. Coming on and come on anytime. Just let me

Fabian Romo: Tom, quick question for you, what, what, what kind of stuff you got going on right now? Obviously, there’s a lot of things, what, what are projects you’re working on? You’re, you seem like the very entrepreneurial type from the times I’ve, I’ve spoken to you. 

Tom: Yeah. Well, I got a super, super secret one that I can’t talk about, which I’m 

but if, you know, if, if yeah, so, but, but, you know, people might find out about that at some point. But yeah, so there’s that. And then I’m doing a world tour. So I’m, we’re doing a, this year we’re doing some, like, we’re doing like four [00:59:00] spots in the States. we’re doing, I think four spots in Australia and we’re doing a New Zealand. We’re doing LA England. And I think that’s it that’s announced right now. And so we’re kind of gearing, gearing up for that. But right now I’m really just focusing on creating content that are going to help. to help dog owners. We’ve also been doing this new project called it’s like reactive dog

Matt Covey: with

Fabian Romo: cool. 

Tom: to like, yeah, I’m

Matt Covey: with the the the the the the the

Tom: Their dog pulled them down and they’ve gone through the ringer and I’m not exaggerating. We posted it. You can see it. It took me 10 minutes to get this dog comfortably neutral around another dog just because they, you know, they weren’t using the proper tools to communicate.

And so I’m doing that, you know, it’s, it’s

Matt Covey: [01:00:00] Congrats.

Tom: I keep at it. You will be. Yeah, it’s so, so I’ve been like really focusing on getting, you know, getting different guests on.

And so I’ve been like really staying after that. And yeah, we got a bunch of travel coming up to a bunch of projects coming up, but yeah, I mean, just, just, you know, brick by brick staying on the grind, you know, every day waking up and just trying to do the best I can. And You know, be a dad and a husband and try to work out and go to jujitsu and, you know get some sleep in 

that.

So, you know, stuff, man. I make everybody, everybody strives to do the same thing. Just stay busy, stay active, do what you love.

Jason: real quick Tom’s in the event that we’ve got listeners who’ve been living on the moon for the last 30 years. Where do they find you? Socials website?

Tom: My Instagram, yeah. My Instagram is at Tom Davis, just my name, Tom Davis. And then my YouTube channel is Tom Davis dog training. And my podcast is no bad dogs. So [01:01:00] you can check me out there on all those avenues. We post full length videos every week on YouTube. We, I post, try to post daily on, on Instagram.

Just, you know, just daily UGC content to help people. And then my podcast, we typically

Fabian Romo: There you 

Tom: So

Fabian Romo: go. 

Tom: it.

Matt Covey: And we will link all that stuff in the description. So anyone who’s listening, if you’re looking for it, just check the description. It’ll be there.

Tom: you so much.

Matt Covey: Absolutely. 

Matt Covey: Thank you, Tom. Appreciate it.

Tom: You’re welcome guys. Have a good day. Thank you.